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John Anderson speaks with Lord Mervyn King about the shortcomings of modern economics, including its detachment from practical issues and over-reliance on modelling. They discuss the failures of economic forecasting during the COVID-19 pandemic and on climate change, stressing the importance of humility and honesty from policymakers. The discussion extends to socio-economic challenges like rising national debt and intergenerational inequality in Western democracies. The conversation also touches on modern monetary theory, quantitative easing, and the geopolitical implications of trade policies, especially with China. Lord King offers a critique of central bank digital currencies and cryptocurrencies, advocating against a completely cashless society. The interview ends with a call for younger leaders to step up and for current leaders to be more transparent about the sacrifices needed to address societal challenges. Baron King of Lothbury is emeritus professor of economics at the London School of Economics, and the former Governor of the Bank of England. He served as Governor of the Bank of England and Chairman of its Monetary Policy Committee from 2003 to 2013. Lord King was knighted in 2011, made a life peer in 2013, and appointed a Knight of the Garter in 2014. His most recent books include The End of Alchemy, and another he co-authored, Radical Uncertainty: Decision Making for an Unknown Future.  -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- 00:00 Intro 01:43 Introducing Lord Mervyn King 02:50 Economics, the 'Dismal Science' 03:50 Economic 'Groupthink' 08:25 The Economic Expertocracy 13:09 The Problem With Modern Monetary Theory 20:50 The 'Lucky Generation' 25:40 Political Dishonesty 32:50 'Young People Are Voting With Their Feet' 37:22 The Economics Of Defence 45:00 'Rational Behaviour' Is Not The Same As 'Optimising Behaviour' 51:51 The Problems Of Climate Change Models 01:02:30 China's Economic Turmoil 01:12:17 Will We Become Cashless? -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Conversations feature John Anderson, former Deputy Prime Minister of Australia, interviewing the world's foremost thought leaders about today's pressing social, cultural and political issues. John believes proper, robust dialogue is necessary if we are to maintain our social strength and cohesion. As he puts it; "You cannot get good public policy out of a bad public debate." If you value this discussion and want to see more like it, make sure you subscribe to the channel here: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCtnYSEGViOnb7k8ezUaWUww?sub_confirmation=1 And stay right up to date with all the conversations by subscribing to the newsletter here: https://johnanderson.net.au/contact/ Follow John on Twitter: https://twitter.com/JohnAndersonAC Follow John on Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/johnandersonac Follow John on Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/johnandersonac/ Support the channel: https://johnanderson.net.au/support/ Website: https://johnanderson.net.au/ Podcast: https://johnanderson.net.au/podcasts/ --------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------